INT: Let's go back to the DP. Some director's work with the same DP throughout their career. Others look for the right DP for that kind of project. What is your approach been?
SL: Both. You tend to want to go to the same cameraman because you develop a shorthand. It saves time and emotional energy. That's the advantage of working with the same one. HITCHCOCK always worked with same one. A lot of directors feel that. There have been other times, I change the cameraman because I don't know if they will get the project. It can happen with great cameramen. I began my career by doing six or seven movies in a row with BORIS KAUFMAN but he was a black and white cameraman and he never understood color and I wound up needing a new DP.

INT: Describe the collaboration with the DP. From developing a look and approach. How much do directors handle the DP?
SL: You start with the broadest and get down to the most specific. Broad stroke was - [INT: For PRINCE OF THE CITY.] Yeah. This is a story in which the leading characters and the leading dilemma slowly emerge and since I never know where I am with the characters - who's the villain, who's doing what - I want the backgrounds to change as the picture progresses. In the beginning, it starts on a completely naturalistic level. As little artificial light as we can make it on location, no color control whatsoever. By the way, the art director's almost always in on these conversations because they have to work so closely. I mean if the set's the wrong color, there's nothing the cameraman can do to fix that. But slowly, that's for the first third of the picture. Second-third of the picture, the two are in balance. I want to see the foreground as easily as I see the background. Third-third of the picture, f*** the background. The people are all that matters. We're gonna obviously go from wide-angle lenses to very long lenses by the end of the movie. I'm laying out the color scheme. By the end of the movie, I don't want to see what color is. Every set is grey by the end of the movie. I'm setting up, literally, the visual style of the movie and ANDRZEJ, we would sit and go scene by scene. And he would mark the script, just like an actor. Into the thirds, and then within the thirds, getting from part one to part two which means starting it early because I don't want the changes to be abrupt. Into finally the individual lighting of a particular scene so that if I came into a scene in the last third of the picture, I might say to ANDRZEJ, "The wall looks a little high." But that's how tight the collaboration is.

INT: What about camera movement?
SL: I determine that, too. Camera movement is laid out in relation to the editing template. In most instances, I don't like to cut into movement. Don't like to interrupt movement with cuts. The largest single element in those decisions is what I want the editing tempo to be like. Because a cut is tempo. It's like a metronome. If I want it to be a very heavily cut sequence, there will be a lot of set-ups, static. I'm in gonna do that with that scene, chances are I will bracket it with a legato scene ahead of it and a legato scene behind it so that it has the effect I think it needs.

INT: What are other factors that cover the shooting of a scene, fixed frame versus cover up?
SL: I only do enough in those instances to protect myself. If I find that it doesn’t work or if the film is too long, I will cut the scene for dialogue reduction. There is a minimum of protection for maximum of editing. Generally, I like to put up what I shot. This partially comes from the days before I had final cut. If I gave the studio editors a lot of choice it meant someone else would use them. DARRYL ZANUCK considered himself a great editor, most of the moguls did. JOHN FORD would leave DARRYL ZANUCK with about 200 feet of film to work with in order to protect his movies.

INT: How do you work with a DP when you have a clear sense of where the camera should go?
SL: You have to be clear enough. Most DPs tend to work out of their department as well they should. Generally a lot of cameramen, like a lot of art directors, tend to want to contribute just a touch too much. They fall in love with a lighting pattern for the sake of, that's visually interesting. They propose interesting visuals which aren't always best for the scene. The same problems come with actors, how do you encourage them to give their best and yet make sure you're all on the same movie? No one element should steal the eye from the movie.

INT: What was the cinematography concept of NETWORK?
SL: It was wonderful and OWEN ROIZMAN carried it brilliantly. Since it was a film about corruption, we would corrupt the camera. There was a realistic look with WILLIAM HOLDEN and PETER FINCH in the beginning, by the end of the movie it looked like a Ford commercial. It was so gorgeous, it looked like A MAN AND A WOMAN, we just gradually made the film look gorgeous. I never liked to see any of this happening. My objection to a lot of work is the stuff that draws attention to itself. I like to sit back and let it hit me. A lot of what I see that I don't like is the stuff that draws attention to itself. In NETWORK we stretched it over 2 hours so you never see it happening.

INT: What about the production designer and their relationship to the film?
SL: It is almost the same as the cameraman. The production designer is always there. They are more prominent in a heavy location shots because they are on the project much earlier. The level of consultation is the same as the DP, only it takes place four months earlier.

INT: What about the different styles and genres, the differences in your work from realistic to the fantastic?
SL: On the naturalistic and realistic ones, if they're primarily on location, I can go with a brand new designer because I know them so well. If I'm going to shoot it here, I just need someone doing the donkey work, except there are always different levels of creativity. I'm not belittling it. But from that, to the range of MURDER ON THE ORIENT EXPRESS, where you need a TONY WALTON. It's interesting. TONY did PRINCE OF THE CITY, it is highly stylized yet realistic. TONY's stylization was great in both. The costumes in ORIENT EXPRESS were more fun for him. Generally, I make more varied choices in production designers, except by now an awful lot of them, since the computer, their reference libraries are so broad, there's almost no problem you can throw at a production designer that he can't find the solution to on the Internet. What used to take him hours in the library are replaced by the Internet in the home. That enormous resource of reference has broadened the work of a lot of production designers.

INT: Have you ever collected images, magazines, or artworks to influence the look of your film?
SL: Absolutely. One of the big things that ANDRZEJ contributed - we finished talking about this idea of faces emerging from the background, he called and said "I've got an idea that the light should be chiaroscuro." I asked "how well do you know CARAVAGGIO?" It was the first money I spent on a movie. I bought a 600 dollar edition of Caravaggio works. We spent a whole afternoon just going through the paintings. He was wonderful. He picked up the style and carried it throughout the film.

INT: How about when you change lens and position, how much relighting is used, or are you not as concerned with editorial continuity?
SL: Generally, my feeling is keep the light sources intact. Don’t shift sources within the scene unless the light is moving. Within that you can cheat, but be true to the source.

INT: Do you have any wardrobe or costume anecdotes?
SL: One of the greats, of course, is ANN ROTH who had a great sense of character. I saw SEAN CONNERY on FAMILY BUSINESS come back from his fitting and say "She just gave me the whole character." What greater compliment could one pay? ANN ROTH got it right down to the hair. For DUSTIN HOFFMAN's character, she knew a barber in Brooklyn and gave him the perfect hair style. In ANGELS IN AMERICA, one of the thrilling things was when the angel entered at the end of act one with her hair curled like out of a 14th century painting. It was just amazing. The curl in the hair, the separation of the curls. I knew that was ANN, despite the brilliance of MIKE as a director. That was ANN. ANNA HILL JOHNSTONE was also superb and sensitive. Great control. Her control in PRINCE OF THE CITY, at the end of the courtroom scenes in the second third of the movie, everyone is in black overcoat. You never see it happening. That's how highly stylized it is.

INT: What about the assistant director, what is the role in your relationship? Have you worked with the same ADs?
SL: I tend to work with same ADs because the shorthand is so important. The last place to take the time to talk is on the set. That's, tic toc, the money is going. [INT: Have you ever been prevented from hiring an AD you want?] No, the first thing I look for is a sensitivity to actors. If I see an AD behave one way to stars and one way to cast members it won't work, he needs to have total respect for day players. If the AD is rude or cold, then that is the last time we work together. Organization is important too. I'm extremely organized which means he or she has got to be three times more organized tough on ADs because I don't want their time to be badly spent. Whether it's well spent or not is really their responsibility because I know I did my job.

INT: Any other key crew members you choose?
SL: All of them. I defer to cinematographer on gaffer and chief grip because they are his right and left hands, but I want to agree on him with the operator. I want him to approve the operator, but it doesn't have to be an operator I've worked with. I've got a wonderful female operator now. SUSAN is the wonderful operator I have with me now. [INT: Any other key crew members?] I do cast and extras too on certain scenes, but the sound man obviously, the mixing crew, and composer.